Fostering Inclusion and Growth: Mentorship, Networking, and Workforce Development in Associations

In this episode of Associations NOW Presents, guest host Lowell Aplebaum, EdD, FASAE, CAE, CPF, from Association Rockstars, continues the conversation on workforce development in the association space. He speaks with Eduardo Arabu, CEO of the National Hispanic Corporate Council, and Justin Bradley Reyes, membership manager at the Latino Corporate Directors Association. They discuss the importance of creating safe, inclusive spaces, the value of mentorship and sponsorship, and the role of proactive networking in fostering equitable professional growth through associations.

Check out the video podcast here: https://youtu.be/dRs0LFsHltE

 

This episode is sponsored by Visit Omaha.

 

Associations NOW Presents is produced by Association Briefings.

 

Transcript

 

Lowell Aplebaum  0:03  
Greetings everyone. Welcome to episode three of Associations NOW Presents, an original podcast series from the American Society of Association Executives. It's my pleasure to be with you. My name is Lowell Aplebaum. Typically, you'll catch me as host of Association Rockstars. It is my pleasure and my honor to be the host of this episode today, which is a part two, as we look into workforce development as our theme. We'd like to thank our episode sponsor Visit Omaha for their support of this podcast. And if you've not yet listened to part one of this two part series on workforce development, we'll be right here.

Lowell Aplebaum  0:39  
So go on, take a listen and come on back for our conversation today. And we are excited to have two wise, wise individuals from our community for our conversation today. For each of you all, just give a brief introduction, a sentence about certainly your name and your organization, but I'd love for to hear each of you introduce yourselves, if you will, with a little bit about your own professional journey, right? So we think about workforce development, what developed you in the workforce? And today's conversation is going to have a large focus on network and community and relationships. So feel free to put into your own journey story, any critical relationships that were really important to your own journey along the way. And so let's first start Eduardo Arabu is the CEO the National Hispanic Corporate Council and the Latino DEI Collective. Eduardo. You want to tell us a little bit about yourself and your own journey?

Eduardo Arabu  1:38  
Yes, absolutely. Thank you Lowell for that wonderful introduction. I'm thrilled to be here and be a part of this conversation with my colleague Justin Reyes as well. A little bit about myself. Yes, I am the CEO at the National Hispanic Corporate Council, that organization focused on helping Fortune companies on their competitiveness and corporate performance around workplace and marketplace strategy. And so we work with major Fortune 1000 companies are under Hispanic and Latino strategy for talent, customer, supplier, community relations and their employee resource group as well. The Latino DEI Collective focuses on amplifying, cultivating and elevating Latino DEI practitioner. So Chief Diversity Officer, Vice President of Diversity Equity and Inclusion, not only in Fortune company, but government, nonprofit, sports and many other sectors as well. I'm based in Chicago. My background is Venezuelan. I consider myself bicultural. So was born in Venezuela, but grew up in Chicago, Illinois. I spent about seven years in Washington, D.C., as well. I think my career trajectory to where I'm at is a little bit unorthodox. Many of you in the association space, we didn't sign up for it. We were voluntold to put you into it, and here we are. My background consisted of corporate functions, HR and government affairs, public policy. I have my time in Washington, D.C., and so more of a business public policy background also works in sports and Government Affairs and many other functions as well. One unique opportunity that I had was to complete a fellowship with the Congressional Hispanic Leadership Institute, where I had a chance to go to Washington, D.C., working corporate affairs and government affairs as well. As we mentioned, relationship, the executive director of the Congressional Hispanic Leadership Institute, when I did my fellowship forward several years, was the executive director at the National Hispanic Corporate Council. So we're emphasizing on relationship. My time as a fellow in that program, go on to go to work in force and go to pursue a Master's Degree in Public Policy at Carnegie Mellon. End up back in Washington, D.C., and I get a phone call from then executive director at CHLI now executive director at NHCC, and he taught me to be the number two person, right hand person to support the National Hispanic Corporate Council. Five years later, the board promoted me to Executive Director, then CEO, and ever since then, been looking for ways to contribute, collaborate, into the association sector and give, take, learn, connect, learn, all those wonderful opportunities as well.

Lowell Aplebaum  4:21  
Excellent. Thank you. And our second, no less distinguished, wise thought leader for today. Justin Bradley Reyes, is the membership manager for Latinos Corporate Directors Association. Justin, why don't you tell us a little bit about your journey?

Justin Bradley Reyes  4:36  
How do you Lowell or Hola, as I'm trying to implement into my vocabulary, especially in the tune of Hispanic Heritage Month. But as you mentioned, my name is Justin Bradley Reyes. I'm the membership manager at the Latino Corporate Directors Association, and have been privileged to hold this role within LCDA over the last couple of years, almost three years and everything membership, managing membership, recruiting Latino talent, developing our regional networking, engagement with our members in the field, and just ultimately, just empowering members to utilize the resources the network, the people at LCDA, to amplify their journey to corporate board. A little bit about LCDA before I dive into myself. LCDA has been fully functional for about 10 years, and the mission of the organization is to create a pipeline for Latino talent, Latino executives, the creme de la creme of corporate America into serving on corporate boards. There's a ton of data out there. Feel free to visit latinocorporatedirectors.org. But just a little snippet is the fact of the matter is with the US population of Latinos, at about 20% of the US population. Latino representation on corporate boards, specifically within Fortune 1000 companies, is at about 5% and so our mission is typically to create a pipeline so that we can reach parity and ultimately support corporate organizations to create a network where they may not have a Latino executive in hopes to elevate the deep pool of Latino talent that does exist, unfortunately they may not have the network to get to that point again as a membership manager, day in, day out, it's been a privilege to be a part of an ecosystem of highly accomplished Latinos, first NASA astronaut and later director of NASA, Dr Ellen Ochoa, a powerhouse attorney, Roel Campos. You have individuals like Marty Chavez who are on the alphabet board. It's just phenomenal that I have the chance to work in support of these individuals. Although I'm not a corporate America expert, through my role as a membership manager, I'm able to contribute to the machine that is LCDA. Now, over the last nine years, I've made a career in association management, or as I tell some folks, I'm in the acronym business. So whether it's the national association home builders, NHB, ABC, NASDA, now, LCDA, I've had the opportunity to be a part of something much larger than who I am. It allows me to scale the impact of my work beyond where I call home, and it's really because I have an inborn fondness for associations that merge public and private partnerships to uncover solutions for whatever industry that they serve. And so that's just been a phenomenal journey, and it all started with an organization called NASDA, National Association of State Departments of Agriculture shortly after graduating from college, with the intention to teach in the classroom, which I did. But just before that, I had a brief sit in DC where I had the opportunity to attend congressional meetings and just interact with these senior policy officials around agriculture. A few months before that, I was working in the fields of South Texas wearing boots and jeans and a cowboy hat and just working my butt off, just lots of manual labor, and then shifting to a setting with suits and policy, it just really transformed my outlook in life and expanded the horizon that I have in terms of what can I do, not just in education, but professionally. And it was so infectious that two years later, I decided, let's make this a full time gig. So after working two years in the classroom, started with NHB, and been all downhill since then. I am Latino, a Mexican-American distend. But of course, being from Texas, being proud Texan, I am Tejano, which for the audience, if you don't know what that is, it's an individual of Mexican-American descent, born in Texas. So thought to be a little extra there. But anyway, small town in Texas. My family is multi-generational American but really the back load of my family is we're ranchers, we're farmers, we're cowboys, and so it was really a great to be a part of that. But again, fast forward today. I now call Charlotte, North Carolina home with my wife, a government affairs professional with Lowe's, who used to be a trade association professional, as well as my niece Raylene, and, of course, my two fur babies, Bailey and Begonia.

Lowell Aplebaum  9:12  
Thank you. In both of your journeys, there is this aspect and this element of network and community. And so as we're thinking about workforce development, I want to talk about that for a little bit. I want to talk about from two or three angles. So the first let's talk about for the responsibility of associations and organizations that often are the organizers right of these critical places where professionals come together, where the opportunity is should be in the room for those relationships to be made that can then lead to career journeys, to those opportunities that nordo You said someone to tap you on the shoulder, to say, No, you need to come to to my organization and work here. We need to have you. I'm just curious about either of your perspectives, about what role you think associations, the organizations themselves, and leaders can play in facilitating more equitable networking opportunities, whether that's live at conferences or remote or hybrid ways. Right? How should associations create the spaces so more of those critical connections can be made? 

Eduardo Arabu  10:17  
I would say, to answer your question, the responsibility falls on two sides of the coin, right? One is individual. As leaders in that space, whether entry level or more senior role, have a responsibility to make sure that they find the most opportunities that they can program, get involved, volunteer, all that good stuff from an individual perspective. But I also think that the organization also has to be intentional, and part of that process, and so in terms of creating equitable networking space and so forth, is to evaluate their own principles: DEI, diversity, equity and inclusion and belonging, or as ASAE called it, conscious inclusion. And to evaluate organizationally, top down, bottom up, where can they be more inclusive and offer those opportunities? And so whether it's at the organization, board of director, the executive staff, the middle management, entry level intern, all the way internally, from a workplace perspective and also from a marketplace perspective, your customer, your stakeholders, your members, also community relations effort and supply chain supplier diversity, and also granting opportunity from external perspective as well. But I think if the organization can be intentional on what they want to do and provide those opportunity to make those connection, right? The networking, I think it's really important to create capacity building, to create access to senior leader, to create assets or pathways of career mobility, career navigating, and even just offering safe space and ways to feel inclusive and belonging, right? Those employee resource group or affinity groups, or a ways where you can be other at your level or of your background, and have that space to have conversation, whether it's work related or career development or many other opportunities. So organizations that are intentional, and I keep bringing that up there, they want to make that conscious effort to provide networking platforms, I think, really add to the inclusivity and engagement of the associate at the organization

Lowell Aplebaum  12:32  
On either of your journeys, both of you sound like you've had meaningful moments where you've connected with key individuals that have Been accelerants along your own journey along the way. Do you feel like that? Either of you are naturally inclined, like you walk in the room and you just feel comfortable talking to anyone, right? Or there are those that perhaps walk in the room and feel like, who am I supposed to talk to? The obligation you started with there Eduardo, which is the individual obligation for building the professional community that you need. And I just want to leave it open as you think about the experiences you've had or the experience that you would impart in terms of advice or insight to those listening in, how do you go about building that community? How do you walk in the room and figure out who to talk to or actually talk to anyone?

Justin Bradley Reyes  13:17  
Yeah, I'll chime in here. So I think I'm a little bit of an outlier, but it's because of my mother's upbringing. She was a very social person. Unfortunately, she did not have the opportunity to finish her high school education, but that didn't limit her career outlook. First Center of Excellence was doing the work that she did and commanding the respect of the community that we served in, whether it was ironing or cleaning. My mom in the community, small town, Cotulla, she would clean the homes of the judges, the county sheriff, these just influential individuals in the community. And because of that, it exposed me to a network that was just non traditional. And so with that said, I'm like I said a little different. When I walk into a room, I just I'm inquisitive. I'm very curious about how things work. I love to learn how other people's stories, to borrow lessons that I can apply to myself. But more than that, it's about I'm a sponge, and whatever I learn or whatever experiences that I'm able to have, whether or not their mind. You know, I try to share that with other young Latino professionals, other young professionals who may not have the opportunity to sit in the same spaces that I do, and just to impart just these antidotes of interactions that I have and and I think ultimately, what it falls on is just to get to that point, it's creating these safe, intentional spaces for these individuals with untraditional pathways in terms of careers and supporting them, instilling self efficacy, instilling opportunities to develop strong, soft skills so that we're better able to communicate. I think that's really what. It is at the end of the day, is communicating, but more than that, it's about executive presence. How do you advocate for yourself, asking the right questions and following up on interactions? You have this moment where you're in a room, virtually, you're in person, where you meet these folks, but what's the follow up? What are these? I say simple, but best practice this so that you're able to develop a much more authentic relationship from rapport, because then it's almost like an interview. You're checking each other out and seeing, do we vibe with each other? And if we do, how do we intentionally continue this relationship? Where one I can borrow from? Maybe it's your platform, your access. Maybe you're a hiring manager or influential in that space. And likewise, I think Eduardo had mentioned this earlier. It's a two way street. So one I learned from you, but likewise, in interacting with me, you learn a little bit about me. Now, I'm only one part of the greater Latino ecosystem of 20 plus countries, but that little sliver of interaction, I would hope, would educate you and teach you a little bit more about a culture that's just different than what you're used to.

Eduardo Arabu  16:10  
I think, just to keep you very humble, actually, a phenomenal networker is an individual that really goes out there and make it happen, even if it's just a simple introduction or simple hello or so forth. They want to give them a shout out for that. He's always challenging me and saying, Hey, do you know so? And do you know so? And I'm like, No, I don't. How do you know them? ABC, and he's always make those connections. Super excited to be with him. I think we're on a different spectrum of being introverted, extroverted, and somewhere in there, we would manage accordingly how we want to engage in the reception and a conference and a meeting and so forth. And I think for most multicultural people of color and folks, we tend to be very inclusive and welcoming, right? We want to build community. We want to break bread together, right those type of scenarios. And when we go to the quote-unquote "corporate world" or association or professional world, we tend to be a little bit more introverted, not sure how our culture or how we interact, mix them well with more of a professional trick type of environment and so forth. It's looking for ways to build those relationships, make those connections be meaningful, follow up and things like that, but you never know who you can meet in the room. And I really think it takes practice. It takes a little bit of preparation. It takes a little bit of best practices in terms of how to network, how to introduce yourself. People love to talk a lot about themselves. So how do you pose question? Then let that person take the burden of the pressure and let you be more of a listening and looking for ways to make that connection. Oh, you were in DC, so was I? Oh, you're from Chicago. When they right, you start to build those common trades, common skill, common goals and things like that. That nothing the burden, the pressure. But it's not easy, and it all depends on the person level of confidence to do that, and over time, practice, make perfect.

Lowell Aplebaum  18:11  
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Lowell Aplebaum  19:10  
Most of you had a overlap of talking about creating spaces. Justin, you refer to it around the idea of forming a network happens best in that safe and intentional space. Eduardo, you were talking about an inclusive space that you feel like you belong. I was wondering if either of you could just reflect on moments that you've walked into these spaces and you have felt that the space has been designed to be inclusive and safe and intentional, right, like when that has been done. Well, is there anything you can describe so that those listening that want to create those spaces, right? What would you say when you walked into those spaces? What had been done that you experienced that? So maybe there's something there to learn from.

Justin Bradley Reyes  19:56  
I guess. Can I go ahead and chime in here?  So as I mentioned. I'm about nine years into association management professionally, but as a member, a volunteer, an advocate, a leader, I've been a part of an association since I was 14, so almost 20 years. It is at 20 years. But when you bring that up, the first thing that pops in my head FFA, which used to stand for Future Farmers of America. But what was phenomenal about this association was that I grew up in a predominantly Latino community, but in the greater ecosystem FFA, it's pretty diverse. Not once did I ever feel like I was less than in terms of being Latino, we would wear these blue corduroy jackets with our names and where we're from in the back, and that's what united us. And what was phenomenal about it was just the the culture, the ecosystem of support, passing it back, if you will. Here's the FFA model, learning to do, doing to learn, learning to live, and living serve. I'm in my 30s, and I still live by this day in, day out, and it's because of the positive experiences that I had there that had it not been for the FFA, I would have never joined agricultural Teachers Association of Texas when I was a teacher, or the American rabbit Breeders Association when I was trying to figure out, how am I going to select the appropriate rabbit project for my students, and then later on their life, ASAE, Association Forum. These are organizations that that one had a culture where I could be my best authentic self, but likewise allowed me to expand my knowledge, to seek assistance, mentors, and ultimately, to this day, sponsorship from peers like Eduardo, who are able to elevate my profile to a much wider audience, so people know that I'm here, and if there's an opportunity for me to connect and help, reach out and I'm there, when you talk about that, it all started very early on with that student organization.

Eduardo Arabu  22:00  
For me, I've been officially involved with Association space for the past 10 years - first five years as the deputy at NHCC, and now a CEO. So it's been a collective of 10 years. But from a formal professional development, career development and things along those nature, maybe for the past two years, mostly, so to the ASAE, which have been a phenomenal platform. I've never seen anything where leaders of different organization come together to support each other, from A to Z and creating all the different spaces, whether it for us, by us in a certain demographic or culture, into intersectionality, into allyship and to bringing others to the room and so forth. So I never experienced anything. And so shout out to ASAE for what they do and the work that they do with conscious inclusion and many other aspects of their programming. And so I think it's important to not only create those spaces, but also seek it out. Yeah, you don't know what you don't know. So if you're trying to be on a corporate director, the LCDA is a space for that. If you're trying to advance your career in accounting, there's the so-and-so association of accounting or engineering or law or medical, whatever it may be that there are many organizations that support that development within those organization, we need to make sure that they're inclusive and not just one particular group, one particular demographic. And what we spoke earlier about creating those spaces allow for inclusivity, belonging workforce development and many other areas, but then also having inclusive intentional programming. And I benefit a lot of this by going to program that our bridge program to grad school, bridge program to working on Capitol Hill, Bridge Program to Corporate America. These are not only safe spaces, but they're intentional and they're inclusive and promote that certain community to advance whatever sector, whatever field organization that they want to participate in.

Lowell Aplebaum  24:04  
Time always goes by quickly on these conversations. I want to ask one more question, I think, and then we'll start to wrap up. We've been talking about on the journey about creating spaces and creating connections, and the critical nature of relationships and support of workforce development within the minority environment, but also in the general funnel. We live in a day and age where, as much as people love to be together, time is a challenge, and the cost and distance to being in person can be just wondering in your experience, either of you, as you think about a more hybrid or mobile or virtual opportunities for professional community connection, creating that inclusive space that could elevate the voices we need to see shine and learn. Do you have any reflections on how that aspect of virtual right, that aspect of distance, comes to play in terms of workforce development, building a career, seeing strong minority voices be part of our leadership?  

Justin Bradley Reyes  25:00  
So, I've had the opportunity to work remotely over the last nine years, spending seven years in Kansas City and now Charlotte, North Carolina. But one of the most significant challenges in working for an organization like LCDA that's completely remote is staying top of mind within networks. So what does that mean? Without the ability to walk in a room and be seen day in day out. I think, especially for minority professionals who work remotely like myself, we just have to work a little extra harder to ensure that we're noticed and that we're again top of mind, whether it's for career volunteering or simply contributing to projects with that said, what can be done. And I think a lot of that for me within ASAE, for example, is showing up to the ASAE Annual Meeting, showing up for micro-volunteering opportunities. One, I'm giving back to the community. But two, I'm able to interact with other individuals who hold values like myself and forging genuine relationships, or at least for me, finding new role models that I can follow on LinkedIn and on the Internet of Things, and borrow themes of their leadership that I can apply to in my home and community. But with that said, it can be challenging, it can be cost prohibitive. I think organizations like ASAE, with their DELP program, with the CAE scholarship, with the USAE/ASAE travel scholarship, those types of programs help minority professionals overcome these cost barriers. These individuals are wanting to show up, but sometimes, as it may cost a significant amount of dollars and investment just to get to the location and to register and all that. So I think that's really important for organizations and associations to keep in mind, how are we creating an equitable space, and if it doesn't exist, what are some resources that we can allocate so that communities like remote working minority professionals can utilize, so that can share the space, contribute to that culture and ultimately grow professionally. But I think, again, those are just some of the things that that I think have helped me, personally in my own journey,

Eduardo Arabu  27:20  
I've had the opportunity to work remote for about 10 years before it was cool or necessary. However you want to look at it, some people adjust differently for that. Some people like it. Some people don't. And there's lots of challenges around that space of hybrid remote. Return back to office strategy. There are some opportunities and challenges for our conversation in terms of professional development and workforce development as well. I think if we look at it from an internal perspective, that visibility, it's harder when you're working remote or hybrid, especially if you're onboarded virtually, if you have a remote team, if you are 100% hybrid, 100% remote, you may not have those traditional water cooler conversation or some other opportunities of senior leadership seeing you, and I think that's very important to have that visibility that you consider for project or promotion, mentorship and many other opportunities. So you have to take it upon yourself again, personal responsibility. Think out, connect, reach out, identify if it's not available, then start it or start that conversation with some colleagues and so forth. Your career growth is tied to the network that you're able to build, because that is capacity building. Part of that leads to mentorship, opportunity, and, more importantly, sponsorship opportunity. The difference between that mentors help you grow and advise you and coach you the sponsorship. They talk about you when you're not in the room. They are intentionally saying that after I leave or after this project is done, so and so if pipeline for the next level or the next opportunity, or what it might be, I think it's important for you to challenge yourself. If it's a two, three days work week in the office, try to make it three or four, try to do the best you can. And I always adjust it and become accustomed to certain liberties of working from home, but make sure that you are navigating that part correctly, that you are showing up to at many meetings. You're on campus as much as you can, and then when you're there, you're strategically reaching out to mentor sponsors, senior leaders, asking for project networking, hosting a happy hour, whatever it may be, all of those opportunities, and then also externally, if the other part of the conversation is, where can you externally get with ASAE volunteer opportunity, your society, community volunteer leadership position, and many other ways and not wait? For the day, that you need your next job or your next role, that you are actively building a network. You're actively branding yourself, promoting yourself as a thought leader, as a strategist, someone who is competent, someone who's accomplished and have the confidence to lead and manage the next phase of their career and an opportunity for that, an organization as a whole. How can they offer everything that I just mentioned? How are they intentionally creating the state space, the inclusive programming, allowing for development when you're in person, team, development, capacity, building, asset to network, all of that, not only waiting for someone to ask for it, but as an organization offering it, and at least listening to what are the needs of the associate and how can they play a role in that integrated workforce development.

Lowell Aplebaum  30:52  
Love it. All right. I have at least five thoughts that pulled from our conversation today, but I'll let you two go first. Just as we're winding down from our conversation or from your own life experience, as you think about workforce development--the roles and the place that you have had in your own journey, and those that are looking and listening to this conversation to be a guidepost, a partner along the way of their own journey--what is one piece of advice or one insight that you would take and share if someone is looking to take the next step on their professional journey?

Eduardo Arabu  31:29  
I would say one piece of advice is maybe a couple of pieces of advice we don't want this to end. I would say one is to be unapologetically yourself and be bold. It is who you are and ask for things. Raise your hand, speak up, let others know your career path. Take an assignment. Just being very vocal of who you are and what you want and the expectation, and hopefully the organization is able to create those pathways. If not, you may have to seek opportunities elsewhere, but at least you are true to yourself to your goal, and hopefully that leads to the objective that you have. 

Justin Bradley Reyes  32:08  
Well, man, so many thoughts here as well. The first thing that gets in my mind is this term that I've been using for a couple years that learned from a mentor the Greater Kansas City Hispanic Chamber of Commerce, Carlos Gomez, get your hands in the matzah. What does that mean? Get in the kitchen. It's one thing to see the cook making these exquisite meals, but it's another when you lend a hand. So with that said, whether you're a minority professional or not, I think it's really important for us. Eduardo mentioned the allyship aspect of it, right? There's an association for everything, especially when you talk about minority serving organizations that their mission statement or their mission objectives, just like Hispanic Chambers of Commerce, is you don't have to be the premier expert, but you can augment your understanding. You can augment your efforts by partnering with organizations like the one Eduardo leads at NHCC; ALPFA, the Association of Latino Professionals for America. If you're talking about public policy, if you're trying to recruit government affairs professional, guess what? The Congressional Hispanic Caucus Institute has a program that brings in interns to work in Capitol Hill who work around public policies. There are organizations out there doing great work to serve different parts of lack of parity on X, Y and Z, but be uncomfortable in getting comfortable with getting involved with contributing to that point, mentorship, sponsorship, hiring. That's another thing too. Is what are your organization's hiring best practices? Are you regionally attracting talent beyond a 50 mile radius of your organization's located? Are you targeting HBCUs? Are you targeting HSI? Like I said, we can go on and on. Of course I would have to throw in. But you have organizations like SACNAS, the Society for Advancement of Chicanos and Native Americans and Sciences led by my mentor, Juan Amador. I have to give him a shout out there, because he's really what got me into the scene and where I'm at currently. But again, there are these organizations led by passionate people who are committed to the mission statements, and if it's a daunting task, just reach out and ask questions. You might uncover opportunities for formal partnerships, but at the very least, if that's not the outcome, it's at least learning a little bit more. Not just about learning more, but it's about ignoring less. And so that's what I challenge, not only minority professionals, but our allies in the community, is get involved within these ecosystems. You never know who you're going to meet. You never know what you're going to learn that's really going to create a significant impact in the organization, and ultimately, the industries that you serve. When you think about workforce development,

Lowell Aplebaum  34:55  
Love it. I'll just say two or three of the questions I'm walking away with from the. The brilliance you all have shared today. I love the question of, how do you stay top of mind in your network, right, especially when we're at distance? How do we do that? How can our organizations create the opportunity for meaningful visibility so that those who could benefit from mentorship and sponsorship find those opportunities to do how do you come to professional relationship development opportunities with questions and curiosity you become top of mind by learning about others. And then the one I took near the end, how do organizations create safe space and inclusive proactively and not wait for someone to ask for it? Just a few of the questions I captured from you all. Eduardo and Justin, thank you both so much for spending time with us and for sharing your perspectives as we talk about this critical topic.

Eduardo Arabu  35:42  
My pleasure. 

Lowell Aplebaum  35:44  
Thank you to everyone who is listening in to this episode of Associations NOW Presents. We hope you'll join us each month as we explore key topics relevant to association professionals. We discuss the challenges opportunities in the field today and highlight the significant impact associations have on the economy the US and the world. We'd like to thank our episode sponsor Visit Omaha once again for more information you can check out visit omaha.com meetings and be sure to subscribe to our podcast on Apple, Spotify, or wherever you listen to your favorite podcasts for more information on workforce development in the association space, visit associations now online at associationsnow.com Until next time, stay out there. Stay leadership. We look forward to talking to you again soon.